Emilie Giraudet, formerly the Head Of Customer Service Business Support & Sales Steering at GEA Group, shares with Sarah her hard-won and valuable insights from more than a decade of work transforming global service at GEA. Insights include practical advice for how to influence and align key stakeholders, how to set a solid technological foundation, and three keys to successful change management.
Sarah Nicastro: Welcome to the Future of Field Service podcast. I'm your host Sarah Nicastro. Today we're going to be talking about some of the lessons learned on the journey to advanced services. I'm excited to welcome today Emilie Giraudet. Emilie is a global leader with 12 years’ experience in the manufacturing industry and an expertise specifically in customer service. She was most recently the Head of Customer Service Business Support and Sales Steering at GEA, one of the largest global technology suppliers for food processing. She has a wealth of knowledge and experience and has kindly agreed to join us today and share some of that. Emilie, thank you for being here and welcome to the Future of Field Service podcast.
Emilie Giraudet: Hello Sarah. Thanks a lot for welcoming me in your podcast today. Very pleased to be here today.
Sarah Nicastro: I am pleased to have you. Before we dig into talking through some of the lessons you've learned and some of the experiences that you've had in your various leadership roles, just tell us a little bit about yourself and your background and your most recent role with GEA.
Emilie Giraudet: Yeah, sure. I hold a Master Degree in Food Process Engineering and an executive MBA from INSEAD. As you mentioned, I spent most of my carrier within GEA, which is one of the largest global technology supplier for food processing. I dedicated most of my carrier to developing service strategies, businesses and teams, and to driving business and cultural shift towards the more customer centric and performance driven organization. In my last role, I led an ambitious digital transformation project, leveraging customer install-base data through data management and analytics in CRM and analytics cloud in order to steer service revenues and customer experience.
Sarah Nicastro: Good. You make it sound so simple, but we know that it's not. That's what's so interesting about talking through different people's journeys is there really are so many things that you learn along the way. At GEA, you made some significant progress on the journey to advanced services or Servitization and you're here to talk through some of the lessons you learned as you did this. The first area is alignment on vision. What perspective can you share on making the decision to move from spare parts to advanced services, CapEx to OPEX, some of these big, big shifts that manufacturing organizations are making. What perspective can you share on sort of seeing the opportunity to evolve but then creating that alignment around it as an organization?
Emilie Giraudet: Sure. It started with a great vision from top management, that's step by step we implemented in the organization. About 10 years ago, everything started with a visionary top managers at GEA who understood early enough that in order to increase sales and support customers, especially in mature markets, GEA should not only focus on new CapEx investments which were limited in these mature countries and also support existing clients with better services to help them optimizing their plans performance and OPEX management.
Emilie Giraudet: We really had this cultural shift coming from top management, especially looking at the evolving markets in mature organizations, mature countries. In order to achieve this vision, we define an ambitious service strategy with a head of a new after sales and service business unit, a consultant and myself so a very small team at the beginning, working on a strategy that we quickly had approved by the boards. Once the board approved it, we started to implement it in the organization.
Emilie Giraudet: To start and make it easy at the beginning, we built a core team with top service leaders that we picked from the best performing service entities around the world and after that, we worked on building a community around the world, training people, showing the vision, communicating about new service products and new proactive approach that we could bring to the market and at the same time, we started to implement new KPIs to track our performance, to be able really to integrate this culture in the organization and globally, if I look at the progress we made it in 10 years, GEA doubled its service contents from 15% of the revenue to now about 30% of the revenue. Globally service transformation as you know is a long journey. Some more steps are still needed to achieve the company full potential, especially I still believe GEA needs to break down some silos and to foster even more customer experience culture in the organization.
Sarah Nicastro: But I think it's a really good point that even before you start to implement real change or introduce real tech... Different technologies and systems and change processes and things like that, you started the communication and the training on the concept and the culture itself so before you were even saying, here's how you go do this new thing we're asking you to do it was here, understand how big of a role service can play in the organization and what that can look like and really training more on making it a part of the culture. Am I understanding that correctly?
Emilie Giraudet: Yeah, exactly. We had some good examples already. We had some countries where they already shifted their culture and who had a lot of revenues coming from services, would develop new concepts, new services, new approaches to clients so we could leverage this internal benchmarking to encourage other to change and to show the direction. So to make it real and possible achievable for countries who were a bit less mature, I would say. Everything started with the vision.
Sarah Nicastro: That's helpful, when you have examples within your own organization of where it is being successfully achieved because that's, it's a bit different than pointing outward and giving examples that way. I can see how that could resonate quite a bit. I want to throw a bonus question at you because I'm just curious your thoughts. One of the things that sometimes comes up in my conversations Emilie is, because you're saying that you had this vision, the vision started from the top down, the leadership saw the potential and the opportunity and then move forward from that point.
Sarah Nicastro: Do you think it is possible to transform in this way if it doesn't initiate at the top? The reason I'm asking that is because I do talk with folks sometimes who lead service functions and they see this potential, but it's like fighting an uphill battle internally. The company culture itself is more, let's keep doing things the way we've always done them, let's stay focused on our product success or what have you and it can obviously be very frustrating for the people that do see that potential when it isn't a shared vision. Is it a lost course? Is there a way to sort of infiltrate the upper level and share that? What are your thoughts?
Emilie Giraudet: Well, globally, I don't think its waste of time, so I believe there is a lot of potential in service and I'm sure that, I mean, when... I mean, people try to drive this initiative, they can be successful already at their level. Then if they want to really roll this out into the entire organization, I believe they will need to get support from top management to a certain extent or else it's very hard to move the organization. Getting buy-in from top management to me is needed to really roll out this big change and big transformation, but I think demonstrating that you can achieve things on your own at a local level or it gives you power to engage and motivate people. For me it's, we're starting but clearly if your ambition is to roll it out into the entire organization, top management support is needed to motivate the rest of the organization.
Sarah Nicastro: I just, I always feel for those folks because I can feel that frustration of seeing the opportunity, but it not being shared so I was just curious your thoughts. I mean, I agree you have to get it to have it really take hold, but it's a good point of find some ways to demonstrate success that you'd have better luck winning people over with that than just conceptually.
Emilie Giraudet: Mm-hmm (affirmative). If you have good feedback from customers it can really help, I guess, engaging top management.
Sarah Nicastro: Yes. Good point. Okay. Moving on to sort of the next topic which is the importance of organizational structure, when we look at expanding the service business. This is something where at GEA you made some changes to set yourself up for success. Tell us a little bit about that.
Emilie Giraudet: Yeah, indeed. In the last 10 years we tried three main different approaches. We learned on the way. We started, as I mentioned, in 2011 and especially in one of the division or where I was working a segment process, engineering segment, we created a new after sales and service business unit on top of the existing traditional application business unit. That was really a shift already implementing that. As I explained, we started small with a very small team and expanded a little bit but without having a real dedicated organization.
Emilie Giraudet: Only in 2015, GEA implemented a new organization. For the first time we created a global service organization with about 400 people out of about 4,000 service people globally in the organization. The global service organization was responsible for developing new products, business development, technical support with really experts from different domains. They were in charge also of improving processes and competence management so really a central function in charge of steering and making service organization more professional.
Emilie Giraudet: At the same time, we had this local organization that we try to empower and really to give them local responsibilities for them to steer sales and to serve clients as locally as possible so really trying to get closer to customers. That's our second organization. More recently in 2020, we implemented another organization where we remove this global service organization as such, we implemented five different division and what is new is that GEA appointed chief service officers at the board of each division. Then we have service teams in a metrics organization so reporting on one side to the chief service officer and on the other side to the more operational business units.
Emilie Giraudet: During these years, I have really saw top management focus on service continuously increasing and I believe it's also been supported and encouraged by a profitable sustainable growth. I believe GEA succeeded in defining an ambitious vision to start in appointing dedicated resources to implement the vision and they also managed to develop step by step service talents and mindset across the organization. Even if we try different things, I don't think it was failures. It was just new ways of doing things and taking time to structure and change this organization.
Sarah Nicastro: I'm not sure if this will make sense to you, but in my mind listening to the progression that you just talked through, it almost seems like just that not trying something and it not working, but more of an evolution. When you started this and it was a small team and it was focused, it was because it was new. I mean, it was a new focus for the company. You really were still working on making it a part of the culture and determining how you would have success and then it sort of evolved into the second phase where you made some progress. But to me, it seems the chief service officer point is really an illustration of the initial vision permeating the company culture to the point where it doesn't need to be its own separate entity or business unit. It is truly a part of the business. Does that make sense?
Emilie Giraudet: Yeah, it's a part of the business. It has still to be steered so somebody has the vision. Somebody is leading some initiatives and is having power to engage the organization on the change and I believe having this global service organization a bit separate was not sustainable anymore. Globally we are taking care of customers. We want to build customer experience so removing silos, I think it is part of our success and we had to. It's a good way I believe to break down some silos and incorporates better service organization within the different business units.
Sarah Nicastro: That makes sense to me. I think the customer experience is one aspect of it. Again, organizational structure is another topic that comes up a lot in these Servitization conversations because for a company that's really starting as a product manufacturer that's evolving to trying to be a service provider in a Servitized business. I've seen different structures similar to what you've mentioned, sort of a global entity or a separate business unit or a separate function or sometimes people even set it up as a separate business that kind of comes in at the point of after the point of sale and so it seems like it's something that takes some work to your point to try different things and not only sort out what works well and what doesn't, but to evolve as the service success of the business grows.
Sarah Nicastro: But to me, I agree with the point of having it more integrated into the business makes for a smoother customer experience. I also always question the true level of success you can achieve on Servitization if it just remains a separate thing. To me it's, you're really only then buying into the vision of Servitization to an extent rather than I guess doing the work it takes to integrate it fully into the business vision, culture, mission, process, et cetera. It's another very interesting part of the conversation. Okay.
Sarah Nicastro: Next let's talk a little bit about strategy. You have the vision, you've sort of structured yourself in a certain way since start and changed over time and then you have a strategy for how you're going to have success with service, but at GEA this began with needing to have a foundation from which to build and so you uncovered this need of really better defining what the install base looked like and that's where the CRM project that you mentioned earlier came from. Tell us how this tied into the strategy and why it was so important and what that project look like.
Emilie Giraudet: Yeah, sure. I'm very happy to talk about this. It's been one of my core focus in the last years and as you mentioned, it's really for GEA the foundation for developing service business. We truly need to know who are our customers, where are their plants located, what type of installation do they have, to be able to segment clients and be more successful in our proactive sales approach, in designing new solution services and developing services better fitting to client's needs. It's really a foundation to become more proactive and more specific in what we do.
Emilie Giraudet: Maybe let me tell you a little story to start and to show you where we started 10 years ago and explaining why we had to change at a certain time. 10 years ago when we built that business unit, we started to explain the concept of structuring an install base as a foundation for growing our service revenues and I really remember that some of the service heads were very successful, had difficulties in understanding this concept. Okay. I see two main reasons for that. The first one is that at that time service people were mainly reactive in our organization so they would not need to have a list of prospects to approach them more practically so that's one
Sarah Nicastro: Waited for the phone to ring.
Emilie Giraudet: Super reactive, no need to know our clients. The second reason is that at that time GEA had a very centralized approach and were servicing clients from the core technology centers that GEA has mainly in Europe and these technology centers, they somehow have information about customers in their local systems so no need for them to have a very well-structured install base to be able to answer to client needs.
Emilie Giraudet: But everything changed with the implementation of our new organization in 2015, where GEA decided to give more power to the local organization and we realized that this local organization had no access to their install base so it was very hard for them to achieve their budgets, their targets, without being able to proactively approach existing clients because they didn't know them. That's really what drove the change and it took us many steps to get there, I would say.
Emilie Giraudet: For a certain part of the organization, we had very limited... I mean, not limited, but we had siloed data. Data were, I mean, spread around different systems, et cetera, so we had a hard job collecting all the information, put it in a very simple global Excel file to start with. Then we had this project already at that time to launch a new CRM, but we had a freeze from the board so we decided to implement an in-between situation, building an SQL server, starting to structure things.
Emilie Giraudet: Finally, one year, two years ago, the cloud CRM was approved and we were able to clean and migrate data in CRM to build a global community of users globally to define governance model and really to progress there. It was really the foundation for us to start with. I believe GEA now has data good quality accessible in a CRM cloud for the entire organization and now GEA can leverage this information to develop sales steering analytics. Okay.
Emilie Giraudet: In terms of analytics, GEA has two main KPIs that they are looking at. One is the market potential. Market potential, we define them and GEA defines how much service business they can generate from each install base. Okay. The second KPI we are looking at is what GEA calls the capture rates. It's basically the ratio between what's the legal entities are achieving in terms of sales and their potential. Two main KPIs that GEA has been using for a while already, what needs to be improved and what we started to work on in the last months, I would say is to make these KPIs more operational.
Emilie Giraudet: The local teams really accepted it's not enough to say, this is your potential, here you go. They want to... They need to trust it and that's where having data of better quality, more accessible, allows us to utilize more advanced concept like machine learning, also engaging people using design thinking concepts to develop more advanced and more detailed market potential calculation. At the same time, we also develop some dashboards to allow people to visualize their data and to be able to really take better data driven decisions based on the reality in their market.
Sarah Nicastro: This had to be a really interesting experience for you and for the rest of GEA leadership because you already had the vision and you already understood the potential without the real data. I mean, it had to be so affirming to then have the data come together and to look at the potential in real numbers and the real scale of what was possible with the service focus. That's really interesting. I wanted to make one point of clarification because I know I got confused by this when we spoke the first time and I don't know if our listeners may be smarter than I am, but, so when you talk about local versus central, so when you started this project, you had the small group to start and then you had the business unit and now you have the chief service officers, but the strategy, the innovation, the technology, those things are centralized, but the execution is localized. Am I understanding that correctly?
Emilie Giraudet: Yeah, exactly. Sales and execution are localized. Exactly. To be able to visit clients so I remember two years ago, I visited Chile for instance and I was already responsible of this install base and we organized some workshops to understand how to structure things, what do they need and so on and what came out of this workshop is that, yes, they need the install base to be able to increase their revenues but they had information about the install base, it was very limited so they told me, Emily it's great to know that this plant is in Chile, but Chile is huge. I need to know exactly what type of plan do we have in which city. Okay. Then they had very limited access to our systems so the SQL server we had at that time was not approved by IT for instance so we could not allow global access to our information so having good quality data and being able to see it was really key for local people to visit clients, to improve their knowledge of clients and their performance in service.
Sarah Nicastro: That makes sense. I only point that out because it's another common conversation that comes up is around to what degree to standardize and to what degree to allow some level of regional or business unit or partner depending on the circumstance kind of individualization. That's why I was pointing out that the strategy, the innovation, the technology use are handled at the central level but the execution is at the local level.
Sarah Nicastro: I'm curious in terms of the CRM project and really bringing this data to existence and to life, to be usable by the entire organization. I'm curious what the reaction has been both from the company and what has it been like for folks to have access to this information and what type of feedback did you get there? But also from the customer perspective, this is really, if you're talking about moving from a reactive model entirely where it was, okay, something's wrong, we need to call for service to this level of being able to be far more proactive on providing service and looking for advanced service options and things like that. I'm curious the reaction and the feedback on both sides.
Emilie Giraudet: From the internal perspective, even if 10 years ago it was difficult to convince some people I think that the change of mindset progressed, so nobody was against or not able to understand the concept. I think everybody was in need. Also the fact that we implemented this global organization in 2015, GEA had to work with different divisions and some divisions were more advanced so already had the CRM on premise not on cloud, but had this higher maturity, I would say, in managing their install base. It was quite obvious that it was needed so nobody had to be convinced. Everybody saw the interest. We just had to do the hard work, cleansing the data, migrating the data, training people, so buy-in was already there. In terms of customer perspective, I see different... I receive different feedback. The first one is that GEA is a complex organization and GEA develops different technologies.
Emilie Giraudet: In the past GEA would have some experts in different technologies and would visit client for one specific technology and another expert would visit the same client for another technology. Finally, I think now local people have access to the entire information of the install base for GEA and it's a big advantage for them. So clients, instead of receiving visits from five different experts for their installation, they would receive visit from one person having the entire understanding and visibility on what is installed. That's one.
Emilie Giraudet: Secondly, I mean, with CRM came not only the installed base but a ticketing system. All correspondence with customer can be done in this system and it's transparent, accessible to everyone. It also increases the internal transparency and it's immediately perceived by customers so they don't have to repeat twice the same thing to two different people because we have hold historical information in our system. I think customers now get a feeling that we have a much better global understanding of their installation and not simply experts coming to solve specific problems that they have.
Sarah Nicastro: That makes sense. It's really interesting, you said how hard of a journey it was to cleanse that data, to consolidate that data, but as we talked about at the beginning it is the foundation for anything from that point forward and so you mentioned things like machine learning and it's taking the time and this is something that is always a lesson learned when I ask folks that have transformed service, what's one of the biggest lessons you learned? It's always the importance of good data and it's going to be harder than you think it's going to be, but there are no shortcuts, those types of things so it's interesting. Okay. You had said to me a comment you must show impact to continue progress and I think we alluded to this honestly a little bit earlier when we said if someone is finding themselves in a position where they see potential for the organization that may not be shared, look for an area to make impact, to gain the attention and the buy-in to continue progress but in your instance, tell me what you mean by that statement.
Emilie Giraudet: Yeah, sure. I fully agree to convince people to be able to get more resources, more budget in an organization. I believe it is crucial to be able to prove what you achieve so I'm going to share what I personally do usually. I usually do my best to use a combination of analytics and customer centric approaches when I drive my teams and my project. As a Six Sigma Black Belt, I systematically take time at the beginning of a project to define the scope clearly, to define objectives and KPIs that I want to measure and to achieve. Okay. That's to me really crucial and I know a lot of people don't necessarily do it, even if it looks very obvious. During the project, I really take time to monitor my KPIs and also very important to communicate it regularly to key stakeholders for them to see the progress, et cetera, and also for my team to be able to adjust approaches when needed.
Emilie Giraudet: Okay. That's the analytical approach. On the other side, before I start a project I always make sure as well that my teams, my projects are fulfilling our customer needs. Internal, external customers doesn't matter, but you really need to have a clear understanding of what customers really want and as I mentioned, I like to leverage tools such as design thinking, for instance, to really make sure that I have a true understanding of the needs. I believe that then it's easier to show impact when you're able to demonstrate and to measure the progress you've made on delivering customer results okay, to prove your success and to be able to continue progress in your organization.
Sarah Nicastro: Yes. That makes sense. That's really good advice for how you handle that. It always shocks me, but it shouldn't anymore because I hear it often enough but it still shocks me, the amount of people that say, I don't, we didn't measure that, when it comes to KPIs. I think that's a really smart approach, especially because when you look at this project in particular, the CRM project, it really is just the beginning of the potential. I mean, it was setting that foundation and so there will be so many opportunities to build upon that success, but part of that is because you did an excellent job doing it the right way and tracking that progress to make sure that when the next opportunity comes, there's belief in the ability to execute.
Sarah Nicastro: We had a gentleman on the podcast very early on and there was something he said that has always stuck with me and he referred to it as building a strong digital reputation. Meaning if you don't do a good job for whatever reason and we can talk about the many, many things that that could mean, but you ruin your reputation so the next time you try and implement a new tool or a new system, you're going to be met with so much resistance because of that last time so it's important to stay focused on building a positive digital reputation because when you look to build, you need to have a good track record. So that makes sense. Emilie, can you share one of or some of the hurdles that you are proudest for overcoming because we know that this journey is not an easy one. It's nice to be at a point where you can reflect back on some of the success, but there's a lot of really hard work getting there.
Emilie Giraudet: Yeah, sure. Probably the biggest hurdle I faced with that project was related to finding the right collaboration mode with IT department to drive such a global digital transformation projects from and for the business. That was really the toughest part. In 2019, I had to drive different projects around install-base management and sales steering analytics and clearly to work on this project, I needed support from it teams. The challenge was really for me to get support from this IT team because resources are limited and at GEA at least you really have to prove that your project is super top priority to be able to get resources and when I knocked on their door in 2019, it was kind of too late and I was probably missing buy-in from this, the organization to be able to prove how important it was.
Emilie Giraudet: Later in 2019, I started to prepare 2020 and I understood that I really had to drive into nearly a complete change management project starting from convincing top management, engaging business leaders around the world, also getting support from the CRM team to be able to demonstrate the strategic importance of my project to IT. It was not enough to knock on their door and say, "Hey, this is super important." But really showing them that I had commitment engagement from top management, from the business side of the organization, from the CRM team. Then finally after a few months, they approved to support my project and they did a great job at it and we were able to deliver our project on time with good quality. So all good.
Emilie Giraudet: What I learned out of this story is that mapping key stakeholders and really understanding their needs, their objectives, their working modes at the beginning of a project is a key dimension to succeed in driving such a broad cross functional and cross geographical transformation project. If you miss one key stakeholder, it can ruin your project so really important to map early enough key stakeholders, talk to them, understand how they work and how you can make it happen together.
Sarah Nicastro: That's really smart. I'm smiling because it's really smart. Also, there's a bit of tenacity thrown in. I mean, you deserve some credit for being resourceful and understanding, well, if it's not going to work this way, then let me kind of go about it in a different way. That's really good. Okay. What would you say outside of this project specifically or related, whatever you want to share, what do you... What would you say is the biggest lesson you as a leader have learned?
Emilie Giraudet: It's kind of related to this project, but not only so I would say it's about change management. When I was younger and especially when I joined this after sales and in service business unit I was really reporting to the managing director, head of the BU so I thought that people would follow what the MD would say naively which was not true. They would always argue and negotiate and not implement things. I really understood early enough that it's not enough to have very high position to ask your people to do things, you really have to engage them and to motivate them.
Emilie Giraudet: To me, there are three main dimensions to succeed in implementing change. The first one is about motivating people. We are human beings so we need a certain level of excitement, enthusiasm to get things done. I believe it's crucial really to find a way to motivate people around your project. The second one is about showing the direction, so being able to create a vision to make it compelling enough to be able to start the change and to motivate people to act. The third dimension to succeed in change management to me is to be able to slice the elephant into actionable and achievable steps so as to reduce the complexity and encourage continuous success. I really believe that being a leader is not about giving people instruction, but really about motivating people, understanding their needs, designing and communicating a compelling vision and executing plans with clear steps and milestones. All these dimensions are crucial.
Sarah Nicastro: That's really good advice. I think... What I was thinking about when you said you realize that they weren't going to just do what they were asked, they were going to push back. Even if they hadn't pushed back, I think one of the important things to think about with really making an effort in managing change the ways that you just outlined, which were fantastic is the goal should not be compliance because the level of success you're looking to have in this type of global transformation, you won't achieve from compliance. Even if they had said, sure, Emilie, we'll do whatever you're asking us to do, you need commitment, you need a real commitment to the mission, not just somebody that's going to do it simply because they're being told and you're not going to achieve that without making that a priority. That's really good advice as well. All right, any other comments or anything, any closing thoughts you want to share?
Emilie Giraudet: Yeah, maybe one last more so we started with explaining that moving an organization used to selling machines to a service organization is a cultural shift. That's also what I understood during this year is that, it's really crucial to drive organization cultural shifts and even if GEA can be very proud of its transformation to a more service oriented companies, I believe there are still better results that can be achieved especially by engaging a broader audience so we went through this different organization that we implemented so indeed we started engaging a part of the organization, the service organization, I believe now to reach more what we expect in terms of customer experience. We really need to engage a broader part of the organization and it takes time. It's not easy to break down silos and to change the culture but that would be for me the next step, I would say, for GEA to truly succeed and really leverage the potential that they have. This is hard to do.
Sarah Nicastro: What other parts of the organization or what piece would come next, I guess?
Emilie Giraudet: I would say people who are involved in selling new plants, new machines to customers, and really to tighten and to build a closer collaboration between pure service after salespeople and people selling new plants. I think we have a, I mean, in all organization interest into building this and a good way for me to do that would be really to map the customer journey so really to step out of internal processes and how things are done in an organization, but really looking at the customer journey and building a map to improve customer experience that would really facilitate collaboration within different parts of the organization.
Sarah Nicastro: Yeah. I always think too in this type of transformation, the opportunity, once you get into marketing. Like you said, it's every... It takes time. It's a huge undertaking to take a company from being a product business to a Servitized business. But once you start having success and being able to build upon it, it's quite interesting. I was also thinking when you were talking about the CRM project, you're really starting rightly so with a focus on how to wrap your arms around and better serve the install base but even once you're better serving them, then you have the opportunity to start brainstorming with them and thinking about adjacent services or new digital services or what have you. I mean, it really is the potential is limitless and it's exciting, but also overwhelming, particularly for people that are inclined to want to spearhead this type of transformation. It's a really interesting topic and you've had some wonderful points to share. Thank you so, so much for joining and talking with us on the podcast. I really appreciate it Emilie.
Emilie Giraudet: Thanks a lot Sarah. My pleasure.
Sarah Nicastro: You can learn more by visiting us at www.futureoffieldservice.com. You can also visit us on LinkedIn as well as Twitter @TheFutureOfFs. The Future of Field Service podcast is published in partnership with IFS. You can learn more about IFS service management by visiting www.ifs.com. As always, thank you for listening.